Friday, July 2, 2010

Cataclysm Hunter Changes

Cataclysm Beta Hunter Talent Tree
Cataclysm Beta Hunter Skill Drilldown
Blue Posts about Hunters:
Aimed Shot Cast Time / Dead Zone in Cataclysm
It's not a "dead zone." It's a minimum range. I say that because many hunters use "dead zone" to refer to an old design quirk where there was a range at which neither range nor melee attacks would work. We haven't had a dead zone for some time.

If a melee is up in your stuff, you have a couple of choices. Choice one is to use your melee abilities. Choice two, which will probably work out better, is to get away from them and resume using ranged attacks. You have several defensive cooldowns you can use to gain distance or survive long enough to gain distance. Your third choice is to keep shooting even with someone attacking you in melee. By design that is supposed to be quite ineffectual.

In Cataclysm, hunters have some capacity to do damage while moving, but again that's not going to be a super effective way of dealing damage. It's a last resort.

[...] I meant trying to shoot while someone is in melee with you isn't going to work out well. We don't want a model where the hunter goes about his merry way while melee dudes are trying to melee him. (Source)

Looking for Dungeon "Unlock"
The vast majority of our dungeons must now be visited and their entrances explored before you can LFG for that dungeon. A few classic dungeons will always be available that are extremely hard to visit or are low level. Ragefire Chasm, Stormwind Stockade, Deadmines, and Wailing Caverns are automatically unlocked. (Source)

Hunter Changes
We wanted to share some our intent with some of the hunter changes, which will in turn help you give feedback.

Focus -- We'll be messing with ability costs for some time. Depending on your weapon, autoshot costs can be higher than "focus dump" abilities, which clearly won't work. We're working on a DPCT priority list that makes more sense. As far as regen goes though, we think the current rate is about right. We don't want the rotation to become erratic and we like the gameplay of building focus through shots. In situations where you just can't stand still, such as kiting, you can use the new Aspect of the Fox. We've tied the focus regen for using cast-time shots during Aspect of the Hawk, otherwise there would be no reason to be in anything but Fox. Focus is more of a combo between rage and energy, since you build it and use it up. The skill of playing a hunter involves keeping your focus high enough -- as it is somewhat random due to procs -- but use it before you overflow.

Shots -- Each hunter talent tree has a "signature" focus dump: Survival has Explosive Shot, Marks has Chimera Shot, and Beastmaster has Raccoon Shot... I mean Kill Command. These all have cooldowns, so if you are at 100 focus, use Kill Command and still have focus left over, you can use Arcane Shot next. This is why Explosive and Arcane no longer share cooldowns. Once you figure out which abilities to use for each spec, the number of abilities you need to manage should feel less daunting. For example, Marks would use Serpent Sting, Steady Shot, Arimed Shot, Chimera Shot and Arcane Shot on a boss fight, and Serpent Sting gets refreshed automatically. Think less in terms of shot rotations and more in terms of prioritizations.

Pets -- We haven't done our design pass on them yet. The design is for them to no longer receive raid buff since they get complete scaling from the master (and we don't want them to double dip). Their abilities will be divided into 3 categories: basic focus dumps (e.g. Claw), specials (e.g. web), and exotic abilities for the BM exotic pets. Specials never cost focus and basics have short cooldowns but meaningful damage. All pets will do the same dps. We don't want "wolf or die" in Cataclysm (and before that it was cat). Each pet family will bring a unique raid buff, allowing hunters to be wildcards for when you are lacking something. The ease of swapping pets will facilitate this further.

Cobra Shot -- We're not happy with the damage yet. We want BM to basically not use Steady ever again. Marks may use Cobra in PvP situations where spell damage trumps physical damage.

Kill Command -- We like the Frenzy / Focus Fire mechanic, but are likely to make it it's own clicky and not tied to Kill Command. Kill Command itself will be the signature focus dump for BM. For other specs, it will be more situational, such as dealing damage to a target out of your (but not your pet) LoS. Marks also has the Resistance is Futile talent to give it some more use.

Aimed Shot -- We are returning this ability to be an opener once again, like Ravage or Ambush. In longer fights, Master Marskman can proc instant Aimed Shots, to keep the ability relevant.

AE damage -- The design is that you use Multi-Shot on 2+ targets, and Explosive Trap and Volley on 4+ targets.

Venoms -- The focus cost may be too high. However, don't expect to have to use these on every target. Part of separating Serpent Sting from the Venoms so that they could be more situational. Even Serpent Sting isn't necessary on every target, especially those that will die quickly. Instead 2-3 Steadies with an Arcane or Kill Shot should do the job. Hunters are used to using every ability on every target because there is no real resource cost with mana. Now priority and efficiency become important.

Ultimately, we think these changes will solve some of the problems the hunter class has had as well as making them more fun to play, or we wouldn't be going through so much re-design. 


Cataclysm Class Preview: Hunter

New Hunter Abilities

Cobra Shot (level 81): A new shot that deals Nature damage instead of Physical damage. This ability will share a cooldown with Steady Shot. This will give hunters an alternative to Steady Shot on heavily-armored targets, and we will have talent incentives in the Beast Mastery tree to make this a signature shot.

Trap Launcher (level 83): When used, the next trap can be shot to a location within 40 yards. This provides the current Freezing Arrow treatment to all traps and, as a result, we will be removing the current ability Freezing Arrow. 1-minute cooldown. No global cooldown.

Camouflage (level 85): The hunter enters an obscured state that prevents him or her from taking ranged damage. The character would still be subject to melee or area-of-effect attacks, and dealing or taking damage will break the Camouflage effect. The hunter can move and set traps when under Camouflage, and will receive a damage bonus when attacking while under Camouflage (which will then break the effect).

Resource Mechanic Change

Here we come to the meat of the upcoming hunter changes.

  • Hunters will no longer use mana; instead the class will use Focus. Focus generates much like Energy, by building up. It will not be affected by Intellect at all. Haste will improve its generation. Hunters will generate roughly 6 Focus per second, slightly less than rogues' Energy generation rate of around 10 Energy per second. Below, we have listed some examples of how we intend Focus costs to operate:
    • Steady Shot/Cobra Shot: No cost. Generates 9 Focus per shot (or 12 per second instead of 6).
    • Arcane Shot/Chimera Shot /Explosive Shot: 45 Focus.
    • Aimed Shot/Multi-Shot: 60 Focus.
    • Concussive Shot/Tranquilizing Shot: 35 Focus.
    • Rapid Fire/Master’s Call/Disengage: 30 Focus.

Changes to Abilities and Mechanics

In addition to the resource change and new abilities listed above, we intend to make adjustments to some of the other abilities and mechanics you already know well. This list and the summary of talent changes below it are by no means comprehensive, but they should give you a good sense of what we’re going for with each spec.

  • A major change coming for the hunter is the removal of ammunition. Guns, bows, and crossbows will now do damage without consuming ammunition at all. There will be no more ammo slot on the hunter’s character display. Any ammunition that a hunter has at the time of the change will become gray sellable items. Existing quivers will be converted into large bags -- though each hunter can only have one and non-hunters will not benefit from this change -- and we will not be making any additional quivers.
  • Pet management will also change. Hunters will now have two types of attainable pets: active pets and stored pets. Hunters will be able to have up to three active pets (perhaps five for Beast Mastery specialized players) and will have the ability to switch among these pets any time they are out of combat, without going to town. They will also be able to have a large number of pets in storage at the stables. In order to swap a pet from active to passive, a hunter will still need to visit their local Stable Master. However, this should afford ample storage for the many Spirit Beasts wandering the lands of Azeroth.

  • Additionally, hunters will now start with a race-appropriate pet at level 1 and will be able to tame a different pet at level 10. We are also changing many pet family abilities to provide important buffs and debuffs. The intention is to allow the hunter to be able to swap pets and fill a position if a certain role is missing from the group. The goal is to have all pets provide a damage increase that is very similar and no greater than any other pet. Some examples of the changes we are making to the pet families are listed below:
    • Wind Serpents: Will provide a debuff that increases the amount of spell damage taken by an enemy (similar to a weaker version of the warlock ability Curse of Elements).
    • Ravagers: Will provide a debuff that will increase an enemy's Physical damage vulnerability (similar to a weaker version of the warrior ability Rampage).
    • Hyenas: Will provide bleed damage (similar to a weaker version of the druid ability Mangle).

  • Stings and other periodic effects will now benefit from haste and critical strike ratings. Hasted damage-over-time abilities do not lose duration, but instead add additional damage ticks.
  • Viper Sting will now restore 9 Focus every 3 seconds.
  • We are reinforcing hunters as a ranged class. To this end, the class will now start with ranged abilities at level 1, and we will be removing some melee abilities, such as Mongoose Bite.

New Talents and Talent Changes

  • Beast Mastery hunters will have a new talent called Careful Aim, which increases the damage of the next Steady Shot or Cobra Shot, but also increases the cast time of these abilities. The intention is to make the combination of spells into a decent damage opener, especially in conjunction with the new ability Camouflage.
  • Beast Mastery hunters will also have talents that make Cobra Shot superior to Steady Shot, such as Longevity reducing the cast time of Cobra Shot to 1.5 seconds.
  • Rapid Recuperation will cause Rapid Fire to give 20/40/60 Focus immediately and will cause Rapid Killing to generate 3 Focus per second.
  • Efficiency will reduce the Focus cost of Chimera Shot, Aimed Shot, and Arcane Shot.
  • Thrill of the Hunt grants Focus when you land a critical strike.
  • Hunter vs. Wild increases the hunter’s Focus generation when his or her pet is snared, stunned, or rooted.

Mastery Passive Talent Tree Bonuses

Beast Mastery
  • Ranged Damage
  • Haste
  • Pet Damage

Pet Damage: Many of the passive benefits to pet damage will no longer be available in the Beast Mastery talent tree. However, these will be provided through the new Mastery mechanic.

  • Ranged Damage
  • Armor Penetration
  • Double Shot

Double Shot: The hunter will have a chance to launch a free attack off of the global cooldown for 50% damage.

  • Ranged Damage
  • Ranged Critical Damage
  • Elemental Damage

Elemental Damage: Hunter abilities such as traps, Black Arrow, and Explosive Shot will do elemental damage of the following types: Arcane, Fire, Frost, Nature, and Shadow.

We hope you enjoyed this preview, and ask that you provide your initial thoughts and feedback on what was presented here. Please keep in mind that what you’ve just reviewed is a work in progress and as we move closer to the Cataclysm beta, you’ll see these planned changes as well as others continue to develop in response to feedback and testing.


A clarification of Camouflage and what becoming obscured actually means:
Camouflage is *not* stealth. Your enemies will never wonder where you are. We're trying to use the new Cataclysm water effect to put a shimmering PREDATORy visual on you. It's protection from ranged attacks and it gives you some combat bonuses, but it's not like Shadowmeld or rogue / druid stealth where players can't find you.

The idea with it is that Hunters are only vulnerable to melee attacks or ranged AEs while they are in the obscured state. If you target a camo hunter or a rogue using Smoke Bomb, you will get an error message saying something like "Target obscured." You can see them and target them, but can't use your attacks. Imagine they are behind a pillar or something. You can try and get off an AE near them or you can move to melee.

As most of you know, we tried Camo once before, but because it was true stealth it was very hard to balance, plus it felt like we were just handing out the same cool abilities to every class instead of coming with unique mechanics. Hunters were so overwhelmingly excited about the basic idea that we wanted to try it again, but not as stealth.

Regarding Cobra Shot sharing cooldown with Steady Shot:
At this point in time it's not actually a cooldown. Cobra Shot has a 2 sec cast time, but Beastmaster has a talent to reduce the cast time to 1.5 sec (as well as a few damage hooks). Both generate focus so there is no reason for BM to ever use Steady again.

Regarding focus and how much of it Hunters will have:
Hunters will get 100 focus

The focus costs mentioned in the preview are just examples, so it is a little too soon for you to try to min / max your rotations just yet. In general, the basic rotations of all three hunters work okay on live today. With focus you might hit moments where you don't need to Steady at all, and you'll never run dry again for long periods of time like you might with mana.

If the costs of some of the defensive cooldowns are too expensive or even need to be free that's certainly the kind of thing we'll consider.

Regarding Ammo in Cataclysm:
There is no ammo slot on your character sheet in Cataclysm. It no longer exists.

Other known information:

Hunter's can be every race in Cataclysm, except Gnome.
    My Analysis:

    Mana to Focus
    The shift from mana to focus is a huge change for Hunters.  My only experience with an energy system is when I leveled a druid to 70 about two years ago. It seems to work out fine for druids and rogues, so I have optimism that the focus system will work itself out eventually for Hunters, but we might be a bit screwy for awhile after Cataclysm hits (which doesn't sound fun).

    Level 85
    The 5 extra talent points mean that we can now attain a 51 point talent and a 21 point talent in another tree.  However, right now, Counterattack is the worst 21 point talent in the game, and Intimidation is mediocre at best (remove it from the GCD please).  Readiness is our only real solid 21 point talent.  I hope that when they redesign the talent trees we get some love in our 21 point area.

    Cobra Shot (level 81)
    I like that Hunters are getting an elemental shot they can use in place of Steady Shot, that should be very helpful in PvP against high armor targets.  The fact that BM gets the best version of it and will most likely use it always in place of Steady Shot is good in some regard since BM really lacks magical damage at the moment.  Unfortunately, BM still has the most uninteresting shot rotation and this changes none of that.

    Trap Launcher (level 83)
    Replacing Freezing Arrow with Trap Launcher and giving it a 60 second cooldown severely nerfs Hunter crowd control.  The only trap you would launch in PvP would be freezing trap, which is now only available to launch every 60 seconds instead of every 30 seconds.  In PvE this change allows hunters to Trap Launch an Immolation Trap which could be nice.

    Camouflage (level 85)
    This is a complex ability that could be interesting or pretty stupid.  Until more is learned about the bonus damage when exiting this state I just will have to sit on the fence about this ability.


    Anonymous said...

    # In Patch 3.3, pets will scale of all of your stats and allow buffs from raid encounters to affect them.
    # In Patch 3.3, there will be changes to make sure that pets can't be hit by AOEs from bosses but others (PvP) will be able to affect them.

    finally the return of BM?

    Shaedon said...

    Perhaps, hopefully we will get more details about the changes soon.

    Anonymous said...

    this will definitly make BM viable again, not sure wheter or not it will actually be the best spec, (even if you can keep you pet alive BM is still not the highest dps spec) but it will certainly help!

    Anonymous said...

    If mana is going to be replaced by focus, that means Intellect is going to be ignored now. So what will happen to the MM tier 2 talent, Careful Aim?

    Careful Aim (3 points) - Increases your ranged attack power by 33/66/100% of your total Intellect.

    Gimmeabow said...

    Bestial Discipline might also affect the Hunter then, hopefully. There's also Go for the Throat that might be either redesigned or lower the focus gained to affect the hunter as well.

    Shaedon said...

    Our talents and abilities will be the most changed of any class come expansion. I don't expect much to be the same as it is... I hope we see some of their plans over the next month or two.

    Butterfly said...

    How exactly are hunters going to pvp with the focus system? Each shot costing 30-60 focus with a 100 focus pool cap is stupid in the pvp aspect. Not to mention that steady shot is RARELY EVER used in pvp arenas, disabling the 12focus/second regen capability. Rogues have a 10energy/second regen rate with more than one energy regen skill, no? I'd like to see this unfold a little more.

    For the Horde said...

    Hunters losing Mana to Focus makes no sense to me. Is arcane shot going to be renaimed "Focused Shot" -- You cannot focus arcane magics into an arrow if you cannot wield the powers of arcane.

    The fact that Hunters have mana gives them that little bit of mysticysm that most people who use physical attacks (warrior, rogue) cannot comprehend or taim. I always thought it was really neat Hunters used mana, I hate to see it leave, I would even go far enough to say I am outraged and quite upset.

    Anonymous said...

    Anonymous said...
    If mana is going to be replaced by focus, that means Intellect is going to be ignored now. So what will happen to the MM tier 2 talent, Careful Aim?

    Careful Aim (3 points) - Increases your ranged attack power by 33/66/100% of your total Intellect.

    It will probably be replaced with a rogue or DK like talent that lets you increase your amount of focus

    Anonymous said...

    Hunter's Pet Ability Bars should be Longer for example ferocity comes with Heart of the Phoenix and Lick Your Wounds Both EXCELLENT Abilities for Pets but with If You want to put both of those abilities in then More other great moves disappear like say You have a core hound and You like lava breath bite and growl that leaves one space for either heart of the phoenix or lick your wounds it SUCKS So Basically if You understand what im saying and getting at then Pet Ability Bars NEED to Be Bigger or we Hunters need to be able to place our pets abilities on our own Ability bars

    Anonymous said...

    If mana is going to be replaced by focus, that means Intellect is going to be ignored now. So what will happen to the MM tier 2 talent, Careful Aim?

    Careful Aim (3 points) - Increases your ranged attack power by 33/66/100% of your total Intellect.

    It will probably be replaced with a rogue or DK like talent that lets you increase your amount of focus

    there taking out all the stat boosting talents and making them a bonus. so we wont have to worry

    Anonymous said...

    This is gonna make hunter burst suck. Rogues use heavy energy cost abilities (60 energy backstabbing) but their White attacks hit FAST and are landing poisons each hit.

    also won't pet scaling cause them to have to reduce the hunters damage to make it fair to other classes? How about pet SHARE energy with hunter so the player can switch it up if they aren't BM.

    Anonymous said...

    Well, at least we can't be silenced.. Oh wait, no focus means were fucked... Gf survival hunter.. What about traps??

    Chad said...
    This comment has been removed by the author.
    Anonymous said...

    I can get use to any changes with mana to energy, I actually will welcome that change I think.

    BUT please Blizzard! Give us some new pet options... Like maybe a Hydra. Like when Spirit of Atha use to be tameable. Give it to Ferocity tree and give a ability like;
    Bad Attitude
    Snap back for 89 to 125 damage at any target that strikes you for the next 45 sec.

    Since after all it makes more sense for a multiple headed Hydra to have a ability like this then a Crocolisk.

    Oh and PLEASE! P-L-E-A-S-E fix the Rhino. If you don't want it to have Knockback again (why not?) then have it do a stun or something better then a stupid bleed effect. If it must be a bleed effect make it something like Rend or Gouge.

    So the new ability could look something like this;
    Instant - 1 min cooldown
    Your rhino slams into a nearby enemy causing them to bleed for 182 to 246 damage, causing it to take 25% additional damage from bleed effects for 12 sec.


    Instant - 1 min cooldown
    Your rhino slams into a nearby enemy for 182 to 246 damage, incapacitating the opponent for 4 seconds.

    Anonymous said...

    So, I'm currently a 48 Hunter with a 260 LW and I have yet to choose a LW specialty. Originally I was obviously going to go for Dragonscale, but with the mana/intellect change I'm wondering if that's the best idea or not. Any advice would be fantastic.

    Shaedon said...

    It does not matter anymore, at least when you get past 70 it doesn't, as all leatherworking beyond level 70 stuff just requires a certain skill level of leatherworking, but not a style.

    Anonymous said...

    I think what some people here complaining about focus in PvP are forgetting is that there will likely be talents which grant you focus when you do certain actions, similar to some of the rogue talents. For instance, observe the following rogue talents:

    Focused Attacks Rank 3
    Your melee critical strikes have a 100% chance to give you 2 energy.

    Relentless Strikes Rank 5
    Your finishing moves have a 20% chance per combo point to restore 25 energy.

    These are just 2 examples. I'm sure hunters will get talents similar to this.

    Anonymous said...

    I simply couldnt see a hunter w/o mana... Even though w/o mana youd get more stam/agi youd still have limited use of skills. You cant continously use your skills any more, or at least as fast as usual.Aspect of the viper should be a regenerating buff or somthing of the sort. I will hate to see mana go.

    Anonymous said...

    this is stupid. 21 talent sucks. survival will be OP in cataclysm. /wrists, learn to grammar. i would recheck your whole post u ruh-tard, hunters will suck time to re-roll

    Anonymous said...

    Playing Bm hunter since start of the game.
    My first class and my all time fav class
    Stopped playing for 1 year after WOTLK came. Not worth to waste my time
    Now I read this. Focus instead of Mana
    Wouldent it be better that Blizz simply return BMhunters to what they was before WOTLK? Or just remove hunters from game becouse I dont think that they know what to do with Hunters
    And now every race will be able to play hunter hahahhaaaaaaaa

    less work for them and Bm hunters would be able to catch up with other classes.
    Only bright spot that I have in WOTLK and well a little reason to even play the game is my Loque'nahak
    rest OMG
    Leave Mana
    Reduce mana spending for hunter Abilities
    Return The Beast Within to 20 Sec lenght
    fix damn Intimidation or remove it anyway is good
    And let me choose my Pet's abilities as I once did
    That would be simply enough to make Bm hunters equal to other classes
    as for MM or Surv, well MM is ok just as it is now, as for Surv, would not even try to play it
    Makes me sick. Mark my words: this will suck
    If not, I will print my post and eat it


    Anonymous said...

    Would focus mean that we would not get manadrained anymore in pvp, or is there some focusdrain aswell?

    Shaedon said...

    Correct, no mana drain. And there would be no focus drain either unless it also affected energy and most likely rage and rune power as well.

    Noboddy Troll Hunter said...

    Hello i am a bm hunter from a private pvp server (ArenaAddicts) and it is true that bm's are not too viable but i managed to learn it so i can defeat every is a little hard against spriest...and my pet is Ravager cause of wolverine bite(that rules..6 sec cooldown, activates on pet crit XD) so i read your post..and i can hardly w8 Cataclysm to appear. I am a big fan of your site....the bm talent tree i have is from here :D....good luck and kepp the good job

    Anonymous said...

    "Regarding focus and how much of it Hunters will have:
    Hunters will get 100 focus

    The focus costs mentioned in the preview are just examples, so it is a little too soon for you to try to min / max your rotations just yet. In general, the basic rotations of all three hunters work okay on live today. With focus you might hit moments where you don't need to Steady at all, and you'll never run dry again for long periods of time like you might with mana.

    If the costs of some of the defensive cooldowns are too expensive or even need to be free that's certainly the kind of thing we'll consider."

    Start considering right now

    Alonza said...

    For the Horde said...
    Hunters losing Mana to Focus makes no sense to me. Is arcane shot going to be renaimed "Focused Shot" -- You cannot focus arcane magics into an arrow if you cannot wield the powers of arcane.

    The fact that Hunters have mana gives them that little bit of mysticysm that most people who use physical attacks (warrior, rogue) cannot comprehend or taim. I always thought it was really neat Hunters used mana, I hate to see it leave, I would even go far enough to say I am outraged and quite upset.

    I can completely agree with you, I love the fact that hunters can use mana and I'm pissed that they are getting rid of us. It's one of the very few things that sets us aside from the rest of the classes. We can melee and well AND we use magic. Besides that and the fact that we get to choose our own pets and control them to our liking we are just like everyone else. =(

    Alonza said...

    getting rid of it* not us, my bad =(

    Anonymous said...

    uh? about the guy of the Pet Bars, I think there's a reason for all the pet skills to be able to stay in "autocast", I have Rabid and the other dmg bonus skill in my pet's bar, also growl and prowl. However i have spirit strike in autocast, and my bear is able to cast that without being in my pet's bar, so i don't see the problem you're talking about. Unless you want to activate manually bite, rake, etc etc etc. All u need to control is the growl (in case you're in an instance) maybe sprint or prowl, and in case you have a wolf pet, maybe you want to manually activate the dmg booster skills... otherwise, you don't need a bigger pet action bar u.u

    Anonymous said...

    First of all i know they are not done but seriously how many times have they said that, and actualy surprices with genius extra material to that end?

    The most impressive part about our change is that theres no comment if our shots will scale better and hit for alot more in generel cuz if not. At best increase auto attacks speed propperly. I mean hots/dots will scale with haste (OP), Deathknights regains their old free of charge get rid of hots (and prolly some dmg boosts with their new "stockpile" runes shit). Locks will become a TBC loling dot freak with a hint of vanilla WoW PoM/Pyro to it, I CANT WAIT to die over and over to 3 buttons, paladins will run our ass over period, Also camoflage is a piss poor excuse for a new skill, the mage blinks in and AE's, the lock has a dot running minimum, the druid has dots... in fact only warrior wont hit but he bladestorms so that is AoE effect. What exactly will this be any good for, besides maybe on some boss fight (ty for utility LOL). I love hunter for the unique class it is, i just hoped unique wasnt translated to "special" in form of retardation. Blizzard needs a new hunter staff. If i wanted a class that could only be used to have fun with early game, i wouldnt include it in an MMO.

    Buffs to hunter is:
    Alot of focus you cant use cuz your shots are limited to 4 including aimed and sting. HURRAY, that helps their DMG how?
    51 point talent should read "your pet calls for its mate unless it is under the effect of Beastial Wrath. For X amount of time you have an additional pet"
    (took me 10secs to think of that)

    You have 5 more talent points you now need to spit them into Effeciency, rotation the same with a current buff to keep the Bow from ICC ability up. Helping this spec by how much excatly? Only reason we can compete is the T10 bonus (now i can atleast go 10m as MM, thumbs up to that atleast)

    You will like the cobra shot alot, since BA+windserpent will scale it further then StS (unless theres a lock). nothing mindblowing there. (gief pets unique stuff not minor versions that are overwritten by others).

    So basicly theres no new things for us. All the other classes gets interresting new overhauls, we get ammo removal, and by the looks of it no relic/idol/totem for that empty ammo slot in our charcter screen, would be nice if they used their brain and used the same idea on hunters, but we all know that 2 expansions are simply not enough time to look on hunter boards and come up with a plan. And ideas are only good if the dice rolls a 20 during meetings. I dont mind being trampled in melee all damn day in pvp, but if Survival spec was redesigned for a full Melee spec, that would greatly improve the variaties in hunters having both melee specs and ranged specs would be like druids, except for the healing and tanking. Imagine having bow for ranged CC and maybe a talent for making cheetah not stunning you for X amount of time. I would embrace such alterations, and this is what their brilliant minds of a multibillion$ firm comes up with.

    Anonymous said...

    I hope this means that they will be changing the gear that are made for hunters, i mean, all of the "tiers" armor has intellect bonuses, and those will be completely useless to hunters who use "focus."

    Kevin said...

    What pisses me off the most is the "reinforcing of being a ranged class" as if there isn't room for both specialties somewhere within the 3 f'ing talent trees. What is the purpose of the trees anyway? they might as well do away them them, only a couple of classes use them to anywhere near their potential. Way to make a class be both mechanically gimped and lack any gameplay diversity whatsoever.

    I hate WoW, I firmly believe that significant parts of its development are handled with utter incompetence.

    Anonymous said...

    My first main was a BM hunter since release but since all of the nerfing I went on to make my Prot Warrior the main.

    I just wanted to say you have a great site and i always check it out to keep up with my hunter and the latest changes.

    Just waiting for the day when they make my spec viable again instead of just a "levleing" spec.

    Great job!

    Anonymous said...

    Hunters should have a melee option/spec available. It may not be the most optimal "viable" raiding spec but at least give players the choice...maybe a melee/survival/pvp spec as it was intended at launch.

    we are broken /sigh

    Anonymous said...

    Imo, focus will fuck the burst, the thing i love the most about my hunter

    Anonymous said...

    We should have some ability to heal(e.g warriors' Enraged regeneration).Maybe something like:
    X spell: Calls your pet to lick your wounds for y% of your total health.Spirit Bond effect should be increased, too.

    Anonymous said...

    Btw, something like Taste for blood(warriors' arms tree) for kill shot would be welcome, too.

    Anonymous said...

    thank you for you to make me learn more,thank you∩0∩

    Anonymous said...

    The reason warriors got that ability was to make arms a via le raiding spec and make exicute less of a finisher like kill shot is now.

    Anonymous said...

    I think Hunters should also get an aspect that increases their health regeneration greatly when in and out of combat BUT like aspect of the viper it will cut out attack power in half. It would be a great defensive aspect for when you need a little more time and health to get that pally, Death Knight, and Warrior off your back.

    Shaedon said...

    A healing aspect sounds interesting. Something along those lines would be immensely helpful, as Hunters lack defensive measures. And it looks like our offensive measures are being toned down with how focus is going to work compared to mana, so it would help to balance are state of power.

    Darthlawl said...

    I am confused to no end as to why Blizzard has yet to address the hunters who would like to tame EVERY type of beast in the game. One would imagine that the ability to harness a wyvern/gryphon (as a combat pet) would be had by a BEAST master. The mount argument makes no sense since the orcish battle wolves (similar in appearance to wolf mounts) can be tamed. Quit being lazy Blizzard and let us run through the wild with our giraffes by our sides!

    Oh, and lol@ Blizzard failing to come up with a melee option for hunters yet again :\. WAR has done it quite well with the White Lion class; why can Blizzard not pull it off? I seem to remember some pretty bad-ass melee hunters in vanilla, but everything OP about WoW died with BC. The game is still amusing, but what's with the limitations? Sheesh.

    deathstrider said...

    hunters shouldnt have had mana from the beggining. i mean think about it... if you went hunting out in the woods would you have mystical powers? no. I making this change will be good and will help hunters keep a steady rotation.

    Anonymous said...

    Does this mean we can have 5 pets out at once? It would look so cool with a pack of animals following you :D

    Shaedon said...

    No, we'll just be able to easily switch between 5 pets and then visit a stable master if we need to switch out our "active" pets for dormant pets.

    Anonymous said...

    Time to re-roll a shaman...

    Survival pvppve hunter said...

    I agree with the burst comments. With focus, hunters will lose the ability to kill melee before they get close enough to own you. Just imagine the rotation now. Steady/cobra, concussive, lay trap, steady/cobra, steady/cobra, disengage, steady/cobra, concussive, Explosive/aimed shot finally. Unless hunters get an EXTREME damage bonus from camoflauge, we will have to slowly build up our focus to do high damage. Ask any professional melee PVPer how to take down a hunter first thing he will say is run at him! So from the perspective of a survival pvp and pve hunter, i say gimme my mana back.

    However, i do believe blizz as the hunters best interest at thought. I just cant tie dps focus buildup and reinforcing ranged together.

    Shaedon said...

    I'm getting bits and pieces from Hunters in the Alpha posting in forums saying that we are looking pretty amazing.

    Looks like we might be getting some type of healing ability.

    Can't wait for the Beta to come about so we can see what awaits Hunters.

    Anonymous said...

    You don't build up focus people, it's not rage. You start at full focus so you don't have to build up to do damage.

    Anonymous said...

    Let's say some certain abilities do some certain damage and eliminate the variables:
    In a normal rotation, I use:
    Hunter's mark
    Concussive shot
    Serpent sting
    Arcane shot
    Aimed shot
    Chimera shot
    Steady shot
    The GCD is about 1.5 sec so as with mana you would do that 4100 damage(until Chimera Shot) in about 7.5 secs since mana is full and there can be fired a few rotations before it runs out.
    With focus(I can just suppose since i haven't played yet), starting with focus full(100 as they said) it would be something like:
    Hunter's mark
    Concussive shot(35 focus)
    Serpent sting
    Arcane shot(45 focus)
    Steady shot(generates 9 focus+12/sec)
    Aimed shot(60 focus)
    Chimera shot(45 focus)
    Steady shot(generates 9 focus+12/sec)
    You'd have to use steady shot since you'd have just about 38 focus after using arcane in this rotation(adding focus regenerated during GCDs)
    focus: 100
    concussive: -35
    GCD: +6
    Arcane: -45
    GCD: +6
    GCD: +6 6 secs have past
    Steady shot:+9
    cast steady:+12(6/sec)
    Aimed: -60
    Remaining: 11 focus

    So, if everything is correct, you would do 3700 damage in 8 secs, an obvious nerf in burst.

    Anonymous said...

    Edit: I've just seen that Aimed shot has 2 sec cast time so the calculations are wrong in this case.

    Bluud said...

    The changes have definitely taken the gas outta the pvp hunter! The removal of melee abilities for when you are waiting on trap cooldowns and the enemy has gotten in too close, is utterly dumb. The hunter has been known throughout most RPG game systems as a basic fighter and an archer (as well as tracker).

    As far as PVE, I see potential, but then again they are being limited to just that. PVE.

    I'll give a hunter (a fresh one) a try when Cata comes out, but I dont hold any optimism for long term interest.

    Anonymous said...

    i roll a survival hunter because i just like the damage explosive shot does buut this is how i've seen hunter nerfs going in recent patches.....hunter kills a warrior warrior complains to blizzard....hunter gets nerfed....DK gets pwned by hunter DK complains....hunter gets nerfed...anyone else notice this??

    Anonymous said...

    I wonder about Camouflage. If u'll still be visible and can be dispeled by any AOE, it's only use would be to interupt curent cast of the enemy after which he can easily hit u with an AoE spell and take u out

    Anonymous said...

    level 85
    You camouflage, causing you and your Pet to blend into your surroundings. After 3 sec., you will enter a camouflaged state for 1 min, making you untargetable and providing stealth while stationary. While camouflaged, you and your pet's movement speed is reduced by 30%, but the damage done by your next attack is increased by 15%.
    You can lay traps while under the effect, but any damage done by you or your pet will cancel the effect. Cannot be cast while in combat.
    45 Focus, Instant, 1 min cooldown.

    So, if we can not be targetable warrs can't charge, rogues can't target while stealthed so they have to get close and aoe us and so on with other melee classes

    Anonymous said...

    I've been playing my hunter since wow was 3months old. I agree with the comment "Warrior complains, hunter gets nerfed" LoL,,I'm worried that the lack of burst will limit us to just pve. I also agree with the Cant wait to die over and over to rofldotting locks, heck their already op as heck in wotlk. I do however like the fact that thier making an effort to help our class, just wish we didnt get a fat nerfing every patch when we do get something good from the previous patch. Glad I got conqueror title before this xp comes out, pvp nerf INCOMMING!

    Anonymous said...

    been playing since 06
    I love playing all three spec SV , BM and MM ...obviously i don't use BM due to the fact it is gimped ,( BM still not bad in PvP vs some classes esp rogues , Mage )

    My greatest problem with focus is that it's changing a Dynamic of a Class that those that have been playing for a long time really enjoy . This is a great example of sometimes what people ask for is not what they want , they just don't know it yet .
    If you are frustrated with your hunter and asked for this Focus crap please ! god please go create a F'n Rogue or Druid. So that those WHO do Enjoy the Hunter class as it is and has been. Why should we have to change to focus for people that don't really enjoy playing a hunter to begin with ???

    Also , YES we still have a DEAD ZONE . we can attack with "useless" abilities why any other class in the game can just get close to us to stop are ability to do any burst damage . This is an unfair advantage as no other class ion the game is impaired to such a degrees by being in melee range .
    Give all Mages , Boomkin Warlock and Shadow Priest spell shutdown when someone is in melee range outside utility abilities see what the reaction is then ...i would like to see this for a week . and save your L2P speech about being fine with it , because you are just so awesome , i manage just fine myself but when you are fighting very skilled players a weakness like that WILL be exploited and there will be nothing even an wannabe Forum Elitist @$$ hat can do but wait for the rest of his team to die.

    Anonymous said...

    You hunters bitch to much and always have. Stop trying to get what every other class gets and deal with it.

    Anonymous said...

    Using focus is just lame..

    Anonymous said...

    Us hunters are becoming ranged rouges for the most part so that means we are going to have to get really really fast guns/bows/crossbows or we all spec BM for the haste.

    Anonymous said...

    I am for the focus idea despite the several tweaks it will need to go through even after official release. Lore wise I always had a problem with hunters requiring mana and always felt they had more ties to the rogue and warrior class and that mana should tie alone to casters/hybrids.

    Gameplay mechanic changes will be a pain to get use to again, but that is also part of the fun in every big expansion for every class. Hopefully will keep a similar feel to the class in general.

    Anonymous said...

    The patch notes on 7/2010 said: "AE damage -- The design is that you use Multi-Shot on 2+ targets, and Explosive Trap and Volley on 4+ targets." but now Volley is gone. Is this a permanent thing? Is this a glitch? This sucks! Now hunters have no AoE spell worth a crap and all the fun is gone. My wife spent the last 3 years (and $600 in WoW monthly fees) building her Hunter up and Blizz trashed it. What about all her armor. She just spent a ton of gold and so did several friends making her armor that is pretty much worthless now (at least the Intellect is worthless). She spent a lot of gold in the AH too buying arrows, only to have Blizz make them vendor trash. What a rip! They did hunters wrong big time. The pet interface sucks too! It's not much more tedious to call a pet. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

    shaun said...

    i am starting to lose interest in hunters. there seems to be a pattern where they get all these half ass abilities simliar to other classes and a patch later they get nerfed even more. They're really geting pooped on if you ask me.

    Simon said...

    I'm getting so narked with what Blizz has done to the hunters I'm so tempted to just cash out my hunter and quit WoW

    Anonymous said...

    K i dont see why everyone is so exited for focus on hunters, normaly i can fight whole battles in ICC without running out of mana but no i am going to have to wait everyon 10sec for my focus to come back so i can actually use a good move. No one will want hunters in a raid now cause there dps is going to suck majorly, so they will get some other class that dosnt have to to stand there and wait for there focus to come back

    Anonymous said...

    Hilarious reading this post before anyone has had a chance to test the new abilities and rotations. The new hunter changes are the best changes to date, its long overdue. People need to adjust their play style and rotations and you will never "be standing there waiting for focus." Blizz has done an incredible job and finally
    hunter is done right.

    Anonymous said...

    so no AOE for hunters now =/ volley got deleted im guessing?

    RICHYGREEN said...

    what about pet size sczling...what happened to it...i liked the giant pets...devilsaurs actually looked liked a t rex instaed of a raptor wth a bad over bite....oh by the way i drop fifty k aimed shot crits quite often...killing most everything in pve in one shot

    Anonymous said...

    oh and i think camo should be stealth when standing still but the «predatory»bullshit when moving